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OPR Workshops => Difficult => Topic started by: cmpentecost on October 25, 2006, 06:34:29 PM

Title: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: cmpentecost on October 25, 2006, 06:34:29 PM
This has been a long and tough restoration, but fortunately, I was somewhat saved by what was visible through the blue channel.  I've stared at this picture until I'm cross-eyed, so any feedback is appreciated.  I do think he may need a bit of shadowing on his face, and I'm not so sure on his hair, but I need a fresh set of eyes to help me out.

Thanks!!

Christine

Before:  (http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n140/cmpentecost/MELERINEdavid05.jpg)

After:  (http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n140/cmpentecost/MELERINEdavid05forPhotoBucket.jpg)
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: Kenny on October 25, 2006, 07:48:51 PM
Very nice restoration!  :up:


I agree with a little shading on the face. With just a little tweaking, it'll be ready to go home!



Kenny  :)
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: Ausimax on October 25, 2006, 07:55:42 PM


Christine,

You have done a great job, I agree a little shading on the left side of the young mans face, just a touch on the top of his cheekbone, apart from that, send him back to his family.

Max
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: glennab on October 25, 2006, 08:18:59 PM
Hey Chris

I think your concern about his hair is warrented.  I'd try to make the hair and eyebrows look a little more natural, maybe a little lighter.  Was the hair coming down on his forehead something you saw in the channels? It looks a bit contrived to me.

His hand looks great -- in fact the rest of the image is wonderfully restored.  I hope I can be as good as you are when I grow up!

I'd better get with my work -- I'm a bit behind, because Aaron Neville, my favorite cat (don't tell the others!) is in the hospital and I've been a little distracted.

Have a great evening!

GG
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: cmpentecost on October 25, 2006, 09:06:34 PM
Thanks for the great comments and feedback.  I'm attaching a copy of the blue channel so you see what I had to work with.  I was estatic when I discovered how much information was available in the blue channel.  Working on this photo has become a passion, perhaps because it's the 3rd picture of this young man that I've done.  The first was of him as a toddler (the one in the newspaper), then of he and his sister, and now this one. 

Christine

(http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n140/cmpentecost/MELERINEdavid05bluechannel.jpg)

Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: glennab on October 25, 2006, 10:43:00 PM
Hi Chris

Amazing that all that information is in one channel. How do you pull it from the channel and incorporate it into the image?  With a layer?  I'd think this'll help get him a bit more natural looking.

You must feel as if you've raised this guy. How special to bring back so much of his life in these restorations.  Don't know about you, but I love this job!

G'night

GG

Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: cmpentecost on October 25, 2006, 11:10:55 PM
Hi Glenna,

It was a lot of trial and error, and going thru books and NAPP forums trying to figure out how to maintain the blue channel, yet still having color.  I finally ended up basically copying the parts of the blue image that showed through, such as his face, into an RGB format.  The damage was still in black and white, but I then made my best attempt at colorizing the black and white, and matching up with his original skin tones.  I'm not sure if I did it the easiest or best way, but I never came across any other way to do it.  Now that I've taken a break from the photo, I'm seeing areas in his face that need a bit of "shine" and color.  I wish I knew how many hours I spent on this photo.  It's a LOT.  Well worth it though, as it was my hardest restoration to date, and it has become special to me, as I feel like I've gotten to know this young man.  I'd love to meet him some day!

As for cat stories, my Winchester was sleeping on my desk and reached out to stretch, hitting my quick mask button, unbeknownst to me.  Took me awhile to figure out what was wrong with my computer!

Thanks for your great input.

Christine
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: vhansen on October 25, 2006, 11:36:08 PM
To utilize a channel (such as the blue one above), make sure your channels palette is open. 
Click on the blue channel, which automatically selects that channel.
On the main menu choose "select", then "all".
Select "copy" from the main menu (this copies the blue channel to the clipboard)
Click once on the RGB main channel so that all channels are showing. 
Go to your Layers palette and click on the topmost layer to make it the active layer.
Choose "paste' from the main menu. This will paste the blue channel into a new layer.
Change the layer "mode" to "luminosity".  This allows the colors from the bottom layers to show through on your new blue layer.
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: glennab on October 26, 2006, 07:54:02 AM
Hi Vicki:

Great information.  That'll come in handy when I run into what Chris did.  OPR University!  I've learned so much here, and I'm amazed that I'm now the Photoshop guru at work.  (TOO MUCH PRESSURE!!!) I'm trying to correct some gnarly shadows on a woman in an otherwise gorgeous cover photo, and I'm using so much of what I've picked up from all of you experienced pros.  Thank you, thank you, thank you.

Chris:

Bless Winchester's heart!  Where would we be without our feline pals to muck up our already challenging restoration work?

I'll be glad to get Aaron home.  He usually sits on my arm or the mouse and I'm constantly moving him over on the desk.  You've just gotta love 'em!

Have a wonderful day guys!

GG
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: cmpentecost on October 29, 2006, 06:49:56 PM
Well, I think I'm ready to send this young man home.  I've added a bit more coloring/shadow, and did what I could to give him the most natural look.  I got to the point of second guessing everything, but assuming this picture is an 8 x 10, I think it will be ok.  Please give me feedback if you see something that doesn't look right.....I probably won't send it until tomorrow.  I feel like this lad is my own child, and I want the picture to be perfect! 

Vicki, thank you for the suggestions.  I had done a portion of what you suggest, but never did the luminosity part of it.  I wonder if this could have save me from hours of work.....??

Thanks for all your helpful comments.

Christine   :)
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: cmpentecost on October 29, 2006, 06:50:36 PM
oops....here he is:

(http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n140/cmpentecost/MELERINEdavid05COMPLETE.jpg)
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: glennab on October 29, 2006, 10:14:42 PM
Hi Chris

He's beautiful.  Only two things I'd change.  I still think his eyebrows need to be lighter and more natural looking, and the hair coming down on his face seems too hard-edged.

Otherwise, miraculous job!

Do you suppose this photo is of his going into a priesthood?  Rather curious about the ornate robes of the official and the fact that he appears to be receiving a ring.

Have a wonderful week!

GG
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: GP on October 30, 2006, 12:17:05 AM
Hi Christine

great job on this one! The only thing that you could try, is to get his hair to look a little bit more natural
 ( if that's even possible) ::)
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: vhansen on October 30, 2006, 08:12:11 AM
There are three things that don't look right to me:
The priest(?) eye.  A common problem when using one eye to replace another, is that the catchlight in the flipped eye is on the wrong side.  This usually gives the appearance of crossed eyes.  In the example below, I flipped the eye back to it's original orientation and used a layer mask to blend the two together, so that the catchlight is in the correct position.

The boy's face is missing that photographic quality due to the patching and cloning.  If you try my suggestion about using the channel in luminosity, you can retain the photographic qualities and just make some minor repairs.

The boy in the background needs some work on his neck. In the example below, you can see that the information is also visible in the channel.
(http://www.pbase.com/vhansen/image/69413865/original.jpg)
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: cmpentecost on October 30, 2006, 09:39:51 AM
Thank you for all of your comments.

Vicki, what you did is amazing, and I guess it's back to the photo for a bit more work.  It appears I could have saved myself a lot of work.  It's a snowy, cold day in Montana today, so perhaps I can make some improvements.  Thanks!

christine
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: cmpentecost on October 30, 2006, 06:02:39 PM
Vicki and any of you other Photoshop gurus,

I need some help on this, in order to accomplish what Vicki did.  I must be missing a step, or something.  I was unable to copy the blue channel, as "copy" was not available.  However, I did do a "select all", which then allowed me to copy and paste the blue channel. After clicking on luminosity, however, the yellow was still pretty yellow, but just not as bold of a yellow, and I could see thru the colors.

Vicki, would you mind giving me a more detailed description of what you did to achieve the look you got?  I've not really worked with channels before, so this has been a great (yet frustrating) learning experience.

Thank you so much.

Christine
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: vhansen on October 30, 2006, 06:28:16 PM
Christine,
Sorry, my mistake. You are correct. I left out the "select all" part (I've edited my original post).
I'm not sure if I understand what your problem is. 
Quote
the yellow was still pretty yellow, but just not as bold of a yellow, and I could see thru the colors
Are you starting over from scratch?
What I did:  I put your finished image on a layer (set to "color")over the pasted channel layer (changed mode from "luminosity" to "normal"). It's actually backwards from my instructions due to the fact that you've already corrected the color and there is no sense in redoing that.  You may have to make some adjustments here and there (I had to desaturate some red areas in his face as it was too strong).
Does that help?
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: cmpentecost on October 30, 2006, 11:01:28 PM
I think I've got it!  I think I've got it!!!  Stay tuned, as I will post the finished product, but Vicki is my hero today.  Every time I think I know all there is to know in Photoshop, I learn something new.  This is a great forum, and I've learned so much in the 4+ months I've been involved.   :loveit:

I'll keep you posted!

Cheers.

Christine
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: Kenny on October 30, 2006, 11:15:11 PM
Christine, I've been following this one, too.

Channels have always been one of those weird mysteries to me. Same way with curves. Since I've been here I've had my eyes opened to both. Now if I could just learn to really use that pen tool.... :funny:


I can't wait to see the finished work.


Kenny :)
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: cmpentecost on October 30, 2006, 11:36:28 PM
If I can accomplish channels and the pen tool, I'll really be a Photoshop guru.  I've never used the pen tool, but probably need to do a tutorial on it to understand how it works.  Photoshop is such a powerful and huge program.  I've been working with it for 5 years, and while I know a lot about it, realized today how much more I still have to learn. 

I'll keep you posted!

Chris
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: glennab on October 31, 2006, 09:15:39 AM
Hi!

I just wanted to throw a thought in about the pen tool.  If any of you has worked in a vector program (Illustrator, Freehand), it works the same as theirs, with bezier curves.  I find it invaluable when I want to get a very precise selection, don't have enough contrast for the magic wand (which isn't my favorite way to select anyway), or just want to be really close to the edge of part of an image. Make a path, turn the working path into a selection and it'll be as precise as the path is.  The trick is getting comfortable with the bezier curves, and that's a matter of practice.  There's much more control in creating a selection that way. I couldn't do my job without it!

Not very "Photoshop-ish" but it can't be beat for close-in selections.  Give it a try.  It's worth it!

GG
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: Ausimax on October 31, 2006, 10:04:55 PM
Hi,

Just my two cents worth, I have bumbled my way through channels, not as elegantly as Vikki's method but I have found them useful, as far as the paths pen goes. that is my main method of selection, don't actually use the bezier curves all that much, just click around the outline, join the dots sort of thing, I find it much less hassle than any of the lasso tools and quicker and more accurate.

Thats my take on things, anyway I'd better get busy, I have got some pic's out of Becky's gallery and it time to start earning my keep again ( so keep your eye's on the help wanted column).

Max
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: cmpentecost on November 14, 2006, 11:27:44 AM
Hi,

While I'm unpacking boxes, I thought I'd let you guys critique this picture for me.  Does it need more tweaking?  I really want to send it home, but want your opinions.  Thanks!

Christine

(http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n140/cmpentecost/MELERINEdavid05Bforphotobucket.jpg)
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: Kenny on November 14, 2006, 11:37:13 AM
Looks good, Christine  :up:

I was going to say something about the Father's eyes still looking a little off, but I realized it's just because he's not looking at the camera.

I can't see any more that need to be done. Send him home!


Kenny :)
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: cmpentecost on November 14, 2006, 12:51:57 PM
Thanks Kenny.  I think I do need to change the priest's eye a bit, as Vicki had suggested in a prior comment.  I forgot to to this but think he would look better if I "corrected" his vision!

Christine
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: Kenny on November 14, 2006, 01:20:27 PM
You probably already do this, but what I usually do is paint out the dot and make a new one on a new layer. It's so hard to make get them perfect by painting it directly on the eye (at least it is for me). That way I can move the dot around until it looks right.


Kenny :)
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: glennab on November 14, 2006, 02:40:20 PM
Chris -- You did an awesome job on this young man.  I think I'd still slightly lighten his brows, and the shadow between the eyes of the young guy in the back bothers me.  Otherwise I'd say he can go home.

You're a pro for sure!

GG
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: cmpentecost on November 14, 2006, 02:54:09 PM
Thanks Glenna and Kenny.  As for the shadow on the young man in back, my husband and I determined it is Ash Wednesday, or something similar.  That mark is on the original, as are some scratches on his face, so I left them. 

Winchester (cat) is having an awful lot of fun with the unpacking.  I've been unpacking the kitchen all morning, and he buries himself under all the paper!

Christine
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: glennab on November 14, 2006, 03:39:25 PM
Chris -- You're talking kitty heaven!  Winchester must be having a ball!

I've been known to dump a huge pile of shredded paper in the middle of the living room, and all 12 of my monsters have a field day.  It's a riot!  If I don't do that once in a while, they "dumpster dive" and dig in the trash to find old TP rolls or anything else interesting to play with.  Yanking paper out of the bin into which we shred paper is another stunt.  The nocturnal activities result in many surprises in the morning!

I don't envy you all the work of unpacking, but it must be great finding all your treasures again.  Enjoy!

GG
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: kiska on November 16, 2006, 09:28:26 AM
Christine, I agree with glenns about the brows and hair. Too dark and Defined. If you will look at the young man's mouth and nose, they are 'soft', not in sharp focus. It would help to try to match that.
Title: Re: Feedback Appreciated
Post by: cmpentecost on November 16, 2006, 12:20:09 PM
Thank you kiska.  I did soften/lighten the brows after Glenna's comments.  As for the hair....whenever I did try to adjust it, it looked painted.  (I've done his hair many times, but it wasn't until after using the channels per Vicki's tutorial that I got the hair looking the most natural).

Anyway, I sent this young man "home", and I hope the owners are pleased.  It was by far my biggest challenge.  Thank you to everyone who offered their input and assistance.

Christine