Hi all,
I got some very helpful feedback when I worked on my first OPR restore so I'm hoping for more on my 2nd. This restore is still a rough WIP. I'm trying to put the main pieces/contours together before working on the details (edges, blending, textures, etc.). I know the woman still looks 'pasty-faced'. I have a couple of questions and I'd be grateful for feedback on any of them.
- Does the color and white balance look OK?
- Do the contours of the girl's arms look OK? I reckon most of her hands wouldn't be visible. Agree or not?
- I'm not quite sure whether the dark strip on the left is damage or just shadow. What do you think?
- I'm finding the woman's face a challenge. Both the color and luminosity are damaged in most of her face. The real color is still visible on the right in the original. Blending a 'skin color' layer in color blending mode doesn't work well because the underlying layer is damaged. In this WIP, I've blended in the color in 'normal mode' at 40%. If I continue, I'll add shadows and highlights to make her face less flat. But I'm sure this kind of damage often occurs. How do you experienced people go about restoring similar damage to faces?
Thanks,
Mike
(https://s26.postimg.cc/rh8aeb0sl/Citizen_J_23_09_4x6.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/rh8aeb0sl/)
(https://s26.postimg.cc/dc2hchrr9/Citizen_J_23_09_4x6_WIP_1_mike.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/dc2hchrr9/)[/list]
Hi Mike.. thanks for sharing.. you've picked a goodun here lol :crazy:.. on my screen ( and I could be wrong.. I often am) it looks a little drab. Maybe it was like that in the original tho.. I did a levels adjustment in rgb first and it picked it up some.. then I did a neutral gray off of the decoration (ball) on the tree using the "difference" method.. others use different methods to find neutral gray.. the white dress on the little girl (I think it's white) I pushed the numbers up some to whiten it a bit and finally added a tad vibrance.. now it may not have improved it .. just throwing stuff out there..Hannie is really brilliant at color correction.. she's taught me a lot and I keep learning.
Here's what my messing with it ended up...
(https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-dh5ZhcB/0/6320af5d/XL/i-dh5ZhcB-XL.jpg)
I think the girl's arms are a little bigger? longer? and curve more rounded in on the orig. I'm not sure about the dark strip.. may be part of the wall.. not sure.. Others will input. For her face.. hmmm.. tricky.. not much good stuff to steal and jump over the bad. I did try "blur gaussian blur" 1.4 pixels .. hid it with a mask and then painted in where the damage was leaving as much as possible original.. looked pretty good.. worth a try. Some of it you could use the healing brush..
The girls arms.. the texture will be gone mostly... here is a really good method to put back texture in skin.. (don't tell anyone it's probably not allowed.)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kjyXjTAM0Aw
I use it quite a bit.. also I always add noise maybe 2 pix blur maybe 1 and then pixelate-mosiac 2 if that's clear as mud I'm sorry.. if any of this is helpful please don't hesitate to ask more questions.. I find with body parts it's really hard.. I now go online and look up pictures of kids with arms in similar positions to get a perscpective... or hubby walks in and says "arms too short".. either one works for me.
Good luck Mike this is a hard one.. look forward to seeing your progress..
Hi Mike.. just added this.. this is how the skin came out (very rough and ready... I'm sure you'll do a much better job) it was blur.. gaussian blur... 1.7 ... hide it then paint back in..didn't touch a damage of course or lips..I'd probably use healing brush for damage..One last thing.. (you can tell I've been away in a Hurricane?) for the hair? you could jump some good hair to a new layer and mask it back in.. also select some damaged hair and use "filter - blur - motion blur - in the direction the hair is going" just enough to hide the damage.. Good luck Mike.. I know you're gonna do a great restore..
(https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-GbgF8DN/0/e1191a6b/XL/i-GbgF8DN-XL.jpg)
Hi Lynnya,
Many thanks for your great tips and suggestions! And for taking the time to give them.
Yes, your correction looks brighter and more vibrant than mine was. I'll follow your steps. I couldn't easily find a photo with arms in the same position but I may have been searching for 'girl' when - at that age - the proportions would be pretty much the same in a boy, teenager or adult. I'll have another look. I drew the forearms straight and I agree they should be wider and more curved.
The video about adding skin texture is really helpful. New for me. I noticed how quickly he was able to select skin tones on the underlying layer. Something I need to learn. Using smart objects to be able to edit filters too.
I have a 'gaussian blur' layer to smooth parts of the girl's and woman's faces but I deliberately didn't include it in the version I posted.
Using 'motion blur' to restore damaged hair is a great suggestion too.
I've watched a couple of video's on retouching (like correcting color and luminosity on separate layers) but I hadn't thought of applying them to this restore until I watched the video on skin texture.
All in all, I've learned a whole lot from your post!
I hope you and Citrus county are recovering well from the effects of Irma.
Thanks,
Mike
Hi Mike.. I'm glad you got something out of my rant.. I learn soooo much from others in the forum... I am sometimes reticent to suggest as I may be wrong and lead people astray ::) I like Phlearn a lot... I get most of my new ideas from him. I use smart filters a lot too. Shadow will be back soon and she is always a great critique.. she has such good eyes for catching little things wrong.
We are recovering here in Citrus County.. I am amazed at how quickly!! As they say "this isn't our first Rodeo"...
Look forward to seeing your WIP
Lynn
I feel as if I've been working on this pic forever! But I've often put it aside for days (weeks?) at a time. and picked it up again when the mood takes me.
Anyway, this is my second WIP version that I'd like some feedback on. As always, the spots and blends are yet to do. Everything's on different layers (by far the most for me!) and I prefer to tidy up a reasonably consolidated photo. The main things that I'd like some feedback/suggestions on is the woman's face and hair, the girl's arms and everyone's clothes. I'd like to get the 'big things' OK before moving on to the finer details. Any comments on WB or color correction very welcome! Where do you think my priorities should be for further work?
Thanks in advance.
Mike
PS. I decided that the dark strip on the left side in the original was probably damage rather than a hallway. Some of the branches of the XMAS tree are damaged in this strip.
(https://s26.postimg.cc/jyh8v6wjp/Citizen_J_23_09_4x6_-_Copy_2.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/jyh8v6wjp/)
(https://s26.postimg.cc/mh2xvvi9x/Citizen_J_23_09_4x6_WIP_2_mike.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/mh2xvvi9x/)
Hi Mike.. looks as though all your hard work is paying off :up: The thing that jumped out at me was that the woman's eyes were not really believable.. too dark and too white (if you get my meaning lol). I took a swath of the original and pasted it over her eyes (not color correction or anything) and I think it toned them down a lot and made her look more real and softer. Maybe you could take her original eyes and blend them into your restore.. what do you think...(ignoring bad color on skin etc)
(https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-Rr5qbGb/0/b867c5d6/XL/i-Rr5qbGb-XL.jpg)
You're right, Lynnya - thanks!
The whitening and 'red-eye' correction are way too high. I overdid the shadows on her face too - it looks as if she's growing a beard ;)
I'll scale these back and post another one.
Mike
This is my WIP version 3. The differences with WIP 2 are almost exclusively limited to the woman's face/hair (and to a much lesser extent the girl's arms). My thanks to Lynnya for pointing out that I was way too heavy handed on the woman's eyes in WIP 2! I've tried to soften her face up while retaining some 3-D modeling. Spots, edges and blending in the rest of the photo are still to do.
I have about 40 active layers on just the woman's face so I want it to look 'believable' (color, luminosity, shadows/highlights) before consolidating some layers to work on the details of the photo as a whole. I'm still having trouble adjusting color damage (especially green/magenta spots) but I'll post on this separately. The problem does affect the extent to which I can apply curves. Too much often screws up the colors too. I'm gradually learning when (and how much) to blend layers in normal mode. in color mode and in luminosity mode.
I'm learning a lot from this restore!
Mike
(https://s26.postimg.cc/ek7he78sl/Citizen_J_23_09_4x6_WIP_3_mike.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/ek7he78sl/)
Hi Mike... Looking good.. skin on woman looks much better.. I have a suggestion.. it may not work for you but I'm always trying something new... If you select the womans entire face from the original - copy it - and "paste special" then "paste in place" and then reduce the opacity some.. it gives a much more realistic look to her eyes and shadows on the edge of her jawline. You have to remove damage again of course but I tried it and the result looked good. Her now good skin (thanks to you) shows through.
I still think her eyes are too white and the right eye (looking at the screen) is at a slightly wrong angle and there seems to be too much space under the pupil. If you copy and past in place you'll see exactly where the angle etc should be..
Trust me.. I know how hard it is to get past some of these points.. been there done that.. ask the gang.. I'm quite sure you'll get this down pat real soon. Everything else looks great to me. Good luck.. Looking forward to your next wip. :up: :up:
Real rough version... comes out like this Mike..
(https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-hbTMb2q/0/214a8d69/XL/i-hbTMb2q-XL.jpg)
Great tip, Lynnya! Thanks for this.
Blending the original face at about 50% does indeed make her face look much more natural and realistic.
I placed the bottom eyelash on the right eye a touch too low and I didn't curve it enough. That's why the eye looks at slightly wrong angle with too much space under the pupil. Easily corrected.
The whiteness of her eyes is through the color correction and other adjustments to her face as a whole . I've not 'added' any eye whiteness. But her eyes do look whiter than the other two people so I'll tone them down a bit.
Mike
Looking forward to your next wip Mike :up:
Yowzir! What a difficult image. You've come a long way. Will be watching for you next WIP with Lynn :)
The next fun part will be putting her glasses back on. I always find that part icky.
This is my current WIP. version. I have so many layers on this photo that I want to get 'the basics' (faces/clothes,arms) right before consolidating layers to correct spots, edges, etc.
Mike
(https://s25.postimg.cc/oc0n5x1u3/Citizen_J_23_09_4x6_-_Copy_2.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/oc0n5x1u3/)
(https://s25.postimg.cc/jdd4rnsyz/Citizen_J_23_09_4x6_WIP_6_mike.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/jdd4rnsyz/)
Hi Mike.. looking much better.. tiny pick.. (isn't there always lol) on her left eye looking at the screen.. small patch without much color.. drew my eye to it straight away.. :up:
Thanks Lynnya,
I see what you mean about the area on her left eye. Zooming in on her eyes, there's still a bit of more precise work to be done. I think her right eye could be just shade whiter too.
Mike
Mike, you sure are a brave fellow. What a toughie. When I downloaded the latest WIP it comes up as Adobe RGB for the color space so I went back and downloaded the Orig and funny thing, it opens up in Camera Raw? Might just be me. Anyhoo ... on my screen, on the current WIP there are some blown out areas on the dress and ladies shirt. Went back to the Orig and used the Threshold layer to find the W/B points and then added Curves layer and tweaked both. Below is the result. Just a thought ...
(https://s1.postimg.cc/8tkitpjkgr/2017_10_Fam_Chri_MM_1.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/8tkitpjkgr/)
(https://s1.postimg.cc/9eu6g0e8h7/2017_10_Fam_Chri_MM_2.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/9eu6g0e8h7/)
Thanks, Shadow!
I'll check the Raw/RGB thing. I hadn't noticed the blown out areas so thanks for this correction too!
Mike
I haven't spent much time on this over the past 2 weeks but I've tidied up the woman's eyes and hair and I've adjusted the white levels so that highlights aren't blown out.
Feedback please on things I need to do to finish the job.
Mike
@Shadow: I've reset my 'open with camera raw' preference (which was stored in the file).
(https://s1.postimg.cc/12yqhbvf3v/Citizen_J_23_09_4x6_WIP_7_mike.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/12yqhbvf3v/)
Hi Mike.. you've brought this a long way indeed.. bout as far as you can go I'd say.. good work! I'd send them home if it were me.. :up: :up:
Thanks, Lynnya. Yes, I've reached about my limit on this one (in terms of motivation too!). Unless there are any glaring issues or annoying detail, I really would like to move on to something else!
Mike
Mike, you've come a long way on this one and kudos for taking it on. Sometimes it pays to walk away and come back with fresh eyes. The thing that I really notice is the mother's eye on your right. She looks like she has a black eye. I think on the previous page I see the before , if you could use Lynnya's earlier example.
I noticed where Shadow mentioned opening with Camera Raw preferences. Be careful when you do as in the past Camera Raw had a default of the 250 dpi which is not the 300 dpi we have these photos in. Maybe there is something to be said for opening in Raw, but I'm not sure why because these photos are not "Camera Raw" photos. You cannot change them to Raw as they are jpgs. You really don't have the editing ability that you would if they were Camera Raw.
Margie
Mom's left eye: basic levels, curves. Then a dark curves with black mask. Gradually paint in her eye.
(https://s1.postimg.cc/1m4veqqmjv/Screen_Shot_2017-10-14_at_4.10.32_AM.png) (https://postimg.cc/image/1m4veqqmjv/)
Hi Margie and Kiska,
Thanks for the feedback on the 'black eye' and Camera Raw. I'd already turned off the 'Open in Raw' preference.
I'd already followed Lynnya's suggestion too but after repairingg the color/luminosity damage, the woman's face still looked 'flat and pasty. So I had layer upon layer of different shadow and highlight tones (and colors) to 'model' her face. I just masked out 2 of the shadow layers to remove the black eye. Time was running out for this set of photos so I've uploaded my 'final' version for Quality Control.
(https://s1.postimg.cc/7wfu3ougyz/Citizen_J_23_09_4x6_-_Copy_2.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/7wfu3ougyz/)
(https://s1.postimg.cc/77zbxty0ob/Citizen_J_23_09_4x6_mike_final.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/77zbxty0ob/)
Mike,
I did kind of a "quick and dirty" on the the little girl. I also brought back more of the mother's eye on your right that I would work on later. What I do on these kind of photos is find some good areas and use the lasso tool with 2 pix radius (soft edges) and then I do a Ctrl J to copy that on its own layer. I use the short cut key "V" to move and often use the transform tool and then pick flip horizontal if picking from the opposite side of the face. Usually I need to rotate, so will hit Ctrl T and use the handles to rotate. Once I get it where I want, then hit Enter. Sometime when I moved that layer over, the skin did not match, so I did a Ctrl J and duplicated and them went up to "Color Mode" on the layers and would either us Screen or Multiply--one lightens and the other darkens--then I would adjust the opacity and merge down. On her face, when I did that, I used a layer mask and concealed all and then painted in what I wanted. Below is the results and it is still not there.
(https://s1.postimg.cc/1walmqnxyj/Citizen_J_23_09_eye_adj.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/image/1walmqnxyj/)