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mold difficulties!

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stylish lady

Damaged Photos

[cmpentecost]

Hi Dave,

I know you guys are probably swamped, but I'm curious as to when you might release new photos for the volunteers to work on.  Even though I have a lot of irons in the fire right now, with moving into a new house, I miss my relaxation time of working on the restoration projects. 

Your thoughts?

Thanx.

Christine

[Dave]

Christine and all (grid yourself for a somewhat long response),

Here's the situation at the moment. We currently have a bottle neck in quality control. While everyone did a good job of answering the call for help to get the images done for this round, a significant number of those restorations are going to need to go back out for tweaking and/or complete re-do's. We had a couple of volunteers that we're initially helping us with quality control, but they've had to drop out for one reason or another. So right now, Becky and Mike are slugging through it on their own.

Organizationally, we need to tighten up the process of how we release images for distribution. For the next round, we're planning on instilling the practice of one download per volunteer at a time. Once the volunteer has completed the restoration and it has passed quality control, the volunteer will then be allowed to download another image if he/she chooses to do so.

The new process should accomplish the following:

A. Stop individual volunteers from taking more than their fair share at a time or more than they can handle. I love volunteers who are gung ho, but frankly there are some who have occaisionally bitten off more than they can chew and that causes system slow downs.

B. The new process will leave more images of various damage levels available to all volunteers at any given time. Many volunteers have protested that the less difficult images are quickly gobbled up. Part of the reason is that they are easy to fix and a single volunteer will download as many as he/she can. We have a lot of volunteers who want to help, but have never gotten the chance, because there weren't enough images to distribute in their skill set. That just doesn't make sense when you figure we have collected around 2500 images, but have only recently reached the 1,000 volunteer mark. I would also estimate that less than half of our entire volunteer network is active on a regular basis. There should be plenty of images of each level to go around.

C. Making sure the restoration passes the quality control level before releasing the volunteer to do a another image will  alleviate the bottle neck that we are currently experiencing. It will also help with ensuring that no one is "hoarding" images  or taking more than they can turn around in a timely fashion.

D. We will no longer take in the most damaged of images. While we hate to turn anyone away, we need to be realistic about what we can accomplish. The worst of the worst images are the biggest slow down to the entire program. They take up too much effort and sadly provide very little in the way of results. Also, it's a waste of our limited monetary and printing resources to output images that will probably never see the light of day once they're returned.

E. Speeding up the distribution/restoration/printing processes will get the images back to their owners more quickly. We're not a commerical business by any stretch of the imagination, but we need to improve our customer service. That means getting the job done as quickly as possible while maintaining the quality standards that we have established.

To get back to your original question as to when we will start distribution of the next round,, I'm going to whip out my stock answer of "soon". Becky has said she's ready for the next round to start, but I need to touch base with Mike on this and he's away for the next week. The new coordinators need to be set up as well.

We have images waiting to distribute with more on the way along with developing plans for more copy runs. Believe it or not, there are still many photos waiting to be saved out there.

With that said, the holidays are upon us. A realistic goal would be to begin the next round on or shortly after January 1.

Dave

[cmpentecost]

Hi Dave,

Thanks for your thorough answer.  It sounds like the task at hand in sorting through so many damaged and restored photos is tremendous. With the plans you have for the next round of photos, it sounds like things may go a bit smoother in the future.

I look forward to the next batch of photos coming out!

Christine

[Ausimax]

Hi Dave,

Thanks for the heads up! The new system sounds great, I must admit I have never felt happy not having any feedback on my restorations, and waiting for the "other shoe to drop" and have them all bounce back as rejects at the same time.

Now we all have to chew our fingernails to the quick, waiting to see if ours get through, sorry you have not been able to get enough volunteers to work on quality control, it leaves a large load for Becky and Mike, just make sure you all take a break to recover and unwind over Christmas.


Max

[glennab]

Hi Dave

I think you've worked out a great system to cope with some of the frustrations with which you and the rest of the "Fab 4"  (I should include John, so you're really the Fab 5) are dealing.

If anyone grouses about not having a restoration to work on, maybe you could suggest that they work their way through the forum and check out what others are doing or have done and pick up on some of the wonderful feedback and tips offered by the rest of the volunteers.

How are you going to deal with people like me who love being part of OPR but work full time, sometimes overtime, and don't have a massive number of hours in which to work on the photos?  I am able to do 2 or 3 hours most evenings, but I've chosen some extremely complex restorations because  I want the challenge, and I've had a couple of photos for over a month.  I've checked with Mike, and he seemed to be okay with that because I had a specific reason for requesting the second painting for restoration. (I'd done a companion to that one and wanted to be able to glean details from one to be sure the other matches.)

It's so interesting to experience the evolving of OPR, and I appreciate all of you in Admin.  You, Dave, are a fine diplomat, and your expression of what's being changed should keep everyone content and willing to deal with the transition without being too impatient to get more to work on while you're processing what's ready for assessment and possible reassignment.

I'm definitely with Max in hoping that all of you can take some time during the holidays to enjoy the wonders of the season.

Best wishes (you know the routine),

GG

[Ausimax]

Dave,

Back again, the one major problem you (OPR) are going to have address is image distribution, the present system will be totally unworkable under the new rules, being unable to see if someone else has already requested a specific photo, means you have to register for 4/5 to be sure of receiving one.

Unless you can supply the ability for members to see what photos have already been spoken for, or some way for the images to be removed from the galleries as soon as a request has been made. It would be possible to go for months trying to get a photo by pot luck.

I find the system frustrating at present, you ask for several images, then wait and wait, and only know you have missed out when they disappear from the gallery, and you have to start selecting again. This will be exacerbated by the number of members we now have, when new images are posted.

I'm not trying to drop another problem on already overworked people, only trying to make you aware of a looming problem if the issue is not addressed before the next image distribution.

Regards,

Max

[Ratz]

Hi Dave,
thanks for letting us know what's happening, it's good to feel like us volunteers are back in the loop.I haven't posted for a while but I have been checking out the forums every day and seeing what everybody who is still working is up to.
The new system sounds good, but I agree with Max that this could cause a bottle neck for a whole other reason, and a lot of frustration for those who wait weeks for an invite, only to learn the photo has been taken.
All of you guys in admin are doing a great job under difficult circumstanses, but so to are we.
Thanks again and I look forward to the new round starting.
Vicki.

[Dave]

While I'm not ready to announce who the new distribution coordinators are, I can say that there will be more than two. Also, they are volunteers who are some of the most active on the network and in this forum. The new coordinators should be able to provide quicker and more timely efforts to the distribution process than we can currently muster.

There are still going to be issues with the distribution process. Max points out the most prevelant issue of what is basically an invisible-first-come-first-serve basis for choosing images to download. Photoshelter has been a great resource for OPR despite the fact that it's not designed to meet specific our needs. Until something better is developed, by us or through some other opportunitiy, we have to work with the tools we have.

The new distribution coordinators should be able to distribute restorations more quickly and provide more of a live feed of what will be available to restore at any given time. It won't be perfect, but it should be an improvement.

As we've done for nearly a year now, we'll tweak the process as we move along.

Thanks to everyone for your input.
Dave

[mabmsc]

Hi Dave

The new process sounds another good step forward.

From my point of view it would be worthwhile to know, in advance, the biggest issues you had to deal with during quality control.  Something like a top ten list of what to check when you think you have finished the restoration, before you up load your work.  I'm sure the volunteers at quality control would appreciate the same mistakes not being repeated again and again.

Brookie

[kjohnson]

I agree with Brookie. quality control must be a nightmare to deal with and it would be useful to know some of the common issues OPR's having to deal with. I think once volunteers touch base in the forum we get a better sense of what needs to be done & how to it. I'm sure now I could go back and redo my first image and do a much better job since joining the forum.


 

[beckysell]

Hi all,

I think I can provide some insight on quality control (bear with me... this is proving to be rather long!):

First, I really do try to give feedback whenever I am asked.  In my pile thus far, I am organizing over 1,000 images... while I would love to give detailed feedback on every image, it's just beyond my time capabilities to do so.  However, if I am asked for feedback, I always do my best to reply.  The best way to get feedback is this forum right here otherwise.  You'll probably get better tips as well... I am by no means a professional restoration artist like some of you all.

Same if a photograph is grabbed by more than one volunteer... I do my best to drop an e-mail to the other volunteer to let them know the photo they commented on was taken.  Trust me, if there were a quick-fix to this, we would take it... just more time to let people know when it happens.  Also rest assured that, often times, if one volunteer comments on three photos and another volunteer on one of the same and only that one, then the first volunteer gets two, and the other gets the one.  I do my best to spread the load.  Obviously, we are not flawless, and occasionally go out of town, have work conflicts, miss sending e-mails, etc.  Also, on the one-photo distribution... some people pick up 6-8 at a time.  I've had no problem giving 2 or 3 to a volunteer, or more if it's a class/group situation.  It's when 8 are out for 3-5 weeks while other volunteers are ready to work on something that we're talking about.  Spreading the load of distribution with the help of volunteers will also make for more time to keep up with galleries, etc.  Mike and I have been doing it thus far as Photoshelter is a new tool to us, and I know I wouldn't want to try to explain a system I was still learning to someone brand new.  As for finishing it up once we got it down, imagine walking into someone else's office and having to go by the way they organize things instead of building your own way.  Hope this makes sense.  Hence getting others involved on the next batches.


Second, on the quality control.  Most images that I have been working with come back very nicely done, and I honestly mean that when I reply to you and let you know I received it.  Most of the quality control time is spent with a basic levels, which is just the way it must be to prep for printing (everyone's screens are different).  The other portions I spend time working on are the following, and many are not new:

• Replaced backgrounds.  Often times on many of the photos that are so damaged, you have to do whatever you can to make it look better.  Sometimes we know that it will never look like the original again, and some things are lost especially in the backgrounds.  This is acceptable, and I have lost information due to damage and retouching in the restorations I have done as well.  What I'm talking about is the textures available in programs.  Cutting out two people in the foreground that are on a wood-textured wall and placing them on another wood-texture background often times means that the background is sharper than the foreground, does not have perspective or shading, and there is a distint cut-out line.  I am a huge fan of the copy tool in most restorations, and would recommend drawing from other portions of the photo before bringing in an outside texture, color, paintbrush, etc.  Again, this is a tip... adjust this to your own methods, etc. and I understand it is not necessarily applicable to all photographs. 

• Gradients.  Same as above... cutting out people and placing on a different gradient makes the background sharper than the foreground/not natural.

• Small details.  My biggest recommendation from what I've seen during the final stages of the image are, once you feel you are done and ready to upload it, close the image for awhile and come back to it later in the evening, the next day, after a fifteen minute power snack, etc.  Give your eyes a break.  Open up the image again and take a look.  This will give you a chance to see the small portions... specks of dust, blotches, etc.... that can be fixed in a matter of minutes.  After that last look, upload away!

• Blotches.  Try copy tool on a very low opacity and large brush.  Also the color replacement tool is useful as well (I got that tip from a volunteer as well!). 

• Most sepia images are printed in black and white (this is told to the owners as well).  We post the images in their rgb sepia color just to provide you the rawest version so you can work on it however you choose.  If you are having trouble while it is in sepia, grayscale it.  Often times this will solve many problems you had in the color-version.

• Lastly, we often get questions of people wondering who is important in the background, who is not, and wanting very detailed information.  My best advice on this is to take the photograph for what it is first and foremost.  If you have a question about the subjects in the photograph, ask us, and we'll do our best to answer.  If we can not, we'll get a hold of the owner.  For those who are wondering, I have yet to run into an image where I felt someone valuable to the photograph was removed unnecessarily (or at all, for that matter). 

I hope these suggestions help!  Please don't take them as the be-all-end-all for every image, or to mean you've done wrong on work you've uploaded in the past... they are just guidelines from what I've seen on the whole. 

Hope this helps!
Becky

[mabmsc]

Hi Becky

Thanks for your detailed reply, we all appreciate it takes time to post this amount of detail! As a newbie I see this kind of feedback important, but also accept that some of these points are documented elsewhere.   

I can't help but think a peer review or buddy system will allow us to keep the quality control bottle neck away from the volunteer coordinators.  It may just be a simple system of posting restored work on this site for comment before providing it to the coordinators, or it may be a more targeted one to one buddy system.  And before I throw more work your way, I'm suggesting a system that the volunteers organise and not you guys who are already overloaded!

Brookie

[beckysell]

That sounds like a very good idea!  I've really found that some volunteers are very skilled at certain types of restorations, while others at a completely different type.  Could be really useful.

Also, just to add it in here as well, there are a few new images posted to my gallery.  These are ones that have been given to volunteers, and who may very well been doing hard work on, but I have yet to hear from them about their progress (all are over 6 weeks out).  If you are a volunteer who has one of these images, let me know you're working on it, and I'll pull it off the gallery and support you finishing it.  Otherwise, they're back up for grabs.  Thanks so much!  Just trying to keep things moving.

[glennab]

Hi Brookie and Becky,

I thought (and think) that we already have a great informal system for posting restorations for feedback.  I post my work in progress, and hopefully soon, a completed one, for the other volunteers to critique and offer suggestions.  It's taken me from doing a rather flat and contrived photo to one that I'm going to be proud to return, hopefully soon.  There's no way to express how much it helps to have new and unbiased eyes on the restorations' progress.  I find I get so burned out that I can't see half of what others do, or I obsess over something that is insignificant.  The volunteers who have commented on my work have been honest without being brutally so, and I've gained more and more techniques and perspective on what we do.  There's a core group who post regularly, and I believe that their work shows the effect of the input they've gotten from other volunteers.  I hope that's keeping your QC load a little more reasonable.

Best wishes and happy holidays!

GG

[cmpentecost]

I think an non-forum peer review/buddy system might be a good idea.  It appears that we have 477 members of the forum, but only a small number of us have posted our images to the forum for feedback.  Perhaps some of our members are not comfortable posting their work for all to comment on.  If we had a system for volunteers who did not want to post their work to the forums, but wanted feedback, this might help. 

My idea......we have a select number of skilled volunteers be the "private quality control coordinators".  This would not take the work away from the OPR staff, but.....could be a way of helping an OPR member with some feedback.  The OPR member could upload his/her work to Photobucket, and then send a private email to the "private quality control coordinator" asking for feedback.  The private QCC could then offer any necessary feedback on the restoration.  It would have to be done by email, so that is an issue of giving out email addresses.  Perhaps the private QCC could get a OPR email address.

I'd love to have more people upload their restoration work to the forums, but certainly not everyone is comfortable with having their work up for public discussion or criticism.

Anyway, that's my 2 cents this morning.

Christine